Heidi [00:00:03] That also just clicked in my head of how, Oh if money can also be that support in my account and I can see it, that could be really helpful. Like knowing that it’s there to actually use, that money is to be used and then it flows back in.
Linzy [00:00:28] Welcome to the Money Skills For Therapists podcast, where we answer this question: How can therapists and health practitioners go from money shame and confusion, to feeling calm and confident about their finances and get money really working for them in both their private practice and their lives? I’m your host Linzy Bonham, therapist turned money coach and creator of the Course Money Skills For Therapists. Hello and welcome back to the podcast. So today’s episode of the Money Skills For Therapists podcast is a coaching episode. My guest is Money Skills For Therapists graduate, Heidi Lindeman. Heidi is a therapist in private practice in Colorado who specializes in working with spiritual humans who want to move from self-doubt and suicidal thinking into self-worth, confidence, and freedom. She’s also a single mom by choice of a one year old, and that definitely factors into the conversation that Heidi and I have had today. So in our coaching episode today, Heidi brought forward this challenge that so many of us face, where she has started through some hard moves that she’s made in her practice, some big moves. She’s making more money than ever before. And yet somehow that money seems to be going away. She’s made some big purchases, and when she looks at her bank accounts, the amount of money that’s there is not what she wants to see, considering that she is making more money than ever before. My conversation with Heidi almost has two parts. At first, we really dug into some practical pieces around identifying goals and setting up systems for her to be able to actually save for goals, which when you start to have more money, it’s kind of this new level, new devil situation, right? Like you have to start to learn new skills to manage money. And so we get into some very practical pieces of how to save for goals and identify goals to make sure your money is going where you want it to go when there’s more of it around. Then in the second part of our conversation, Heidi and I really sunk into a more kind of emotional and meaning based conversation about what money needs to do for her in her life. What is the value of money? What are her real needs? And how can money help her meet those real needs as well as how can she meet those real needs in other ways so that it’s not all on money to have her needs met? So it’s quite an expansive conversation. We covered a lot of ground today. Really interesting conversation. Here is my coaching episode with Heidi Lindeman. So, Heidi, welcome to the podcast.
Heidi [00:02:55] Thank you. I’m so excited.
Linzy [00:02:57] I am also so excited. We were just chatting in advance. I feel like there’s 7000 things to talk about, but we’re going to dig in. We’re going to dig in today to what you wanted to bring to this coaching episode. So. Heidi, just to kind of frame it out for folks, you are a Money Skills For Therapists grad and you finished up in the course. Where are we at now? Like two months ago. Three months?
Heidi [00:03:19] It was recently. Yeah.
Linzy [00:03:20] Just a couple months ago.
Heidi [00:03:23] January? February? I don’t even know. Time is weird.
Linzy [00:03:26] Yeah.
Heidi [00:03:27] So, recently.
Linzy [00:03:27] Fairly recently, I think we could agree. Okay. Okay. So tell me, what did you want to work on today in our coaching episode?
Heidi [00:03:37] So I really want to work on the growth that I have, but then to like- I spent a lot of money and I don’t think I really like, manage that well or maybe- I don’t know exactly what was happening there. So just for a little context, when I was in the program, the big thing that I was really working on was like, how do I get enough money just so I can pay my personal bills, my private practice bills, that was all working okay. It was that I wasn’t making enough money to buy groceries and, you know, pay for basic things. So there’s a lot of focus on that, raising fees and stuff like that that I did. And then. Oh, some fun news. So during the course, I raised my fees to 225 for new clients. In the last two-three weeks, recently, I’ve had conversations with people to raise my fee for current clients to 225. So everyone’s getting bumped up as of July 1st. So like it feels like things are going really well in that way. And then the last two months I would say I’ve had, as far as income coming in, it’s been really great and like enough to pay for my personal life and things like that. And it’s like, Oh, I can actually make myself a salary and here’s what the number is. And then there’s still extra money left over in my owners pay account, using profit first. Awesome. But then I was literally looking at my money this morning and was like, okay, I have $37 or something in my personal checking account and I overdraft. Crap. I was trying to stop doing that. And then my business account, the expenses are- it was lower than I wanted to see it because I bought some big things. So I bought a new desk and I bought a new chair. I bought this thing behind me, like, really just trying to set up my office space better. But then I had some big personal expenses as well. Like a home organizer?
Linzy [00:05:38] Yes.
Heidi [00:05:39] Was it necessary? No.
Linzy [00:05:40] Yes.
Heidi [00:05:40] Did I want it? Yes. Did I buy it? Hell yeah. But then I’m at this place of like it’s really it’s more my personal than my business. But my business pays my personal. So.
Linzy [00:05:52] Yes. Okay. Yeah.
Heidi [00:05:54] Eugh, money.
Linzy [00:05:57] Money. Right. So deposit in this respect like I do. I do wanna reflect back to you. And I know you know this intellectually, but like, how much progress you’ve made in terms of that fee. Right. Like I remember when you came to Money Skills For Therapists, I think it was like literally on our very first call that you attended, that we ran your numbers with a tool that we have in the course and you identified like, okay, my fee has to go up based on like my needs. And you are, you have a child, your solo parent, so it’s all on your shoulders, right? So you identified this fee had to go up and you spent a lot of time that you were in Money Skills For Therapists you were working on that project, right, of like raising your fee for new clients. And that is hard and scary to have those conversations when you have more of a premium fee. And now what I’m hearing is like it’s starting to actually have effect. You are seeing more money than you saw before. There’s more money now because of that work that you did.
Heidi [00:06:45] Yeah. Yeah. And I had – two weeks ago – ten clients, which is my ideal weekly. Like that’s the goal that I’ve been trying to get to. In the last couple of weeks it’s been nine clients. So I’m like…
Linzy [00:06:54] You’re right there,.
Heidi [00:06:55] Right at like where I want to be at ideally. Okay, things are working or should be working.
Linzy [00:07:01] So I want to reflect back to you. This is like- this is what I would call like a a new level new devil program like problem I should say. So it’s like, before, your problem was like, okay, I need to raise my fee and I want to be working ten clients a week. And so you’re going through the fee raising and having those conversations and trying to find the right people and call in the right clients. And now you’ve gone through the work of like raising your fees with your existing clients and that’s rolling out and now you have more money coming in. But what I’m hearing is the money’s not necessarily staying around.
Heidi [00:07:29] Yeah, particularly the last two months really has been the last two months where it’s there’s been a like feeling of relief, like I can breathe and I don’t have to worry about buying groceries. Like always goes back to buying groceries. Like I used to go to the food bank to get food and it’s like, Oh, I can just buy groceries. And I had my budget, I think set at like 450 or so for groceries, for my personal budget. And then I was just looking at the reports today, which I haven’t done until literally today, like, oh, I’m actually spending closer to like 500, 600, 650 on groceries. So there’s a.
Linzy [00:08:08] Yeah, so you’re getting like a bit of an increase. So yeah, yeah. So let’s, let’s pull this apart a little bit more because what I’m hearing is like you’re seeing your grocery spend is going up at home. Are there other things you’ve made this big – I don’t know how big of an investment – you made this investment in having a personal organizer.
Heidi [00:08:26] It was 2000 something. It was a big investment.
Linzy [00:08:28] That’s a chunk.
Heidi [00:08:28] Yeah. Okay.
Linzy [00:08:29] Yeah. Okay. So you’re that you bought a nicer chair. You bought a nicer desk, you bought what you were referring to behind you was like this really beautiful screen, you know, to, like, screen off your space. So it sounds like you’ve been making some purchases that you just wouldn’t have been able to make before.
Heidi [00:08:44] Yeah, yeah. And they’re- I mean, those ones are I know that they’re like one time kind of purchases. Like, I’m not going to buy a desk every month. And I’m not going to pay for an organizer every month. It’s like I paid her entire fee up front. So like she works with me for-
Linzy [00:08:58] Yes, so that’s it.
Heidi [00:08:58] A while. Yeah, but there was part of like how this is something I’ve grappled with for a long time. Like, how do I know when I have enough money for something? So like how I buy bigger things- and some of them don’t feel bigger. Like this thing behind the screen behind me was like $70 or $90 or something. It’s not a huge purchase. No, the desk was like 300 or something.
Linzy [00:09:20] Yeah, okay.
Heidi [00:09:21] The chair I think was like 70 or 80. It’s like they’re not huge. Huge. But no, like altogether it it adds up. It adds up.
Linzy [00:09:29] Yes. Okay.
Heidi [00:09:29] But like, how to know when do I have enough money to actually do that? And I tried to track it. I used You Need A Budget and like I was looking at it now, like there was enough money in my operating expenses to spend it to like buy something. But then when the number is so low, when I get down to like – I don’t know what it was – a couple hundred dollars sitting in there in my account, it makes me really nervous and I’m like, I have to have more in there because I feel like it’s too low. And yeah, and I’m like, Oh, crap, I overspent now. I should never buy anything, ever.
Linzy [00:10:01] Yes. Yeah. It makes you swing between extremes when you don’t have clarity on- okay. So yeah, so let’s zero in on this part first. So in terms of your operating expenses, so you’re using profit first. So for folks listening, Heidi is using profit first. So your specific kind of bucket of money, that’s for operating expenses, which is the money that it costs to run your business. Right. So the desk and the chair and the screen that you bought would have come out of operating expenses, as do any courses that you buy. You know, so that’s the bucket of money you’re referring to. So with that, it is helpful to work towards having a buffer in it. That’s an actual number that you know when you’ve reached it. So you can be done, right. So what I’m hearing is, for you, you know that this couple of hundred dollars that you’re at, you’re like, this is too low. That’s not enough money sitting there. So the general recommended buffer, Heidi, is is two months. Right. So having enough money in there to pay for two months of like regular operating expenses, do you know how much money that would be for you to get towards a two month buffer?
Heidi [00:10:56] My expenses are somewhere around 800 or so a month.
Linzy [00:11:01] Okay. So in your case, then, 1600 would be like two full months ahead on operating expenses.
Heidi [00:11:08] But when I have that much money in there, like I have so much money, I can do whatever I want.
Linzy [00:11:13] Yes. Yes, okay.
Heidi [00:11:14] So there’s that. There’s also the other – just to throw in another little thing in here – is I started saving for another maternity leave for another baby. And that was also one of my goals. And it’s so cool to actually have started that. And I used a lot of my tax refund money, so there’s actually like $5,000 in it. So like, I have this really- like I can actually set myself up to have a kid when I want to. But then I forget about, Oh, wait, I also need to have that extra money in my operating expenses because the mat leave or the money for that is just to, like, pay my salary.
Linzy [00:11:47] Yes. Yeah. You’ll still need to pay any recurring expenses for your business.
Heidi [00:11:52] So then I need like, I don’t know. Do I need five months saved up or-
Linzy [00:11:56] Yes, yes. This is like kind of a new level that you get to start to build into your your systems, Heidi, which is starting to get clear on like what are those goals, right? And what are those numbers so that you can actually make a plan to get there and so you know when you’ve gotten there, too. Right. So like with your operating expense number, for instance, what I’m hearing is because you haven’t been planning on a specific buffer number, when you get up more around 1600, there’s almost this part of you that’s like spend it like maybe you spender part of yourself comes out. Is that do I understand that?
Heidi [00:12:27] I mean, it might be a spending part, but it’s more of a like, oh, I can be relieved in like, ha, I have money for whatever I want. I don’t have to stress about it. And because I’m not stressing about it or like focused on it. Then I end up spending it.
Linzy [00:12:40] Yes.
Heidi [00:12:41] If I look, I’m like, oh, I’ve got money, I can whatever. Go buy something that’s not budgeted for. That’s what tends to happen.
Linzy [00:12:48] So if we think about like this piece of the puzzle of kind of having a bit of an operating expense buffer builds up. So, you know, when it’s enough for you, how much money would you want to see there? Let’s think about just your normal one even before mat leave. Right? Because let’s almost think about mat leave as a separate project. Just for your normal standard, there’s a there’s a buffer there just in case, for some reason you don’t work for a month or two. How much money do you want to see there for yourself knowing your practice?
Heidi [00:13:14] The first number that came into my head is really low, so I think it’s an interesting things like at first I’m like I want to have at least $500 in there all the time. That feels like. If it- when it drops below the 500, there’s a little bit of like, ooh, is it going to be okay? When it’s at 500, I’m like, I know more money is going to be in there in a week or whatever, because I do my money stuff every week. So I guess I’m always going to have what I need in there, but I think it would be better for me to have it higher. To have it more like 1600 by two- two months. Because that might also then give me more relief in like knowing I can take vacation. That’s also a thing. I’m just going to work forever. Even though I haven’t planned with my fee to have vacation, it hasn’t quite clicked. Like, how do I actually do that?
Linzy [00:14:06] Yes. Yeah, yeah. And we can jump on that part in a minute. That’s a whole other conversation. And I can also guide you back to the resources in the course. Now that you have more money coming in, you’re going to be able to add some elements that are built into money skills, but at the time wouldn’t have been so relevant for you. But yeah, so what I’m hearing is like intellectually, you know, that getting more around like a 1600 dollar mark makes sense. That would give you a buffer in case there’s times that you’re not working because if you’re not making money, you know, you still need to pay for your clinic management software and any kind of recurring expenses. So for you, Heidi, to make that concrete and real, how would you set that up in your systems as like a goal to work towards? How do you specifically save towards goals.
Heidi [00:14:47] Randomly, random? You know, it’s not actually randomly. So I have, I’ve been trying to do things and then getting into places like this and then feeling like it was for no reason or doesn’t matter. So like I have a-
Linzy [00:15:03] Yes.
Heidi [00:15:04] Line item on my- only on my one personal checking account, like a buffer line on a budget and I put money in there. But then this month I was like, well, I have $34. So like, let’s take that money out.
Linzy [00:15:17] Yes.
Heidi [00:15:17] It’s not there anymore.
Linzy [00:15:19] Yes.
Heidi [00:15:19] So like I want to use you need a budget to try to to build it in. But the buffer line just feels weird to me because You Need A Budget- sometimes I get confused if it, so like if I put money in a like a buffer line or a buffer expense, I don’t know, whatever. If it pulls forward to the next month because then I’m like always trying to assess do I have enough money and do I have – not do I have enough money, but is it accurate? Is what You Need A Budget is saying accurate to what’s actually in my bank account.
Linzy [00:15:48] Right.
Heidi [00:15:49] And then constantly like making the profit numbers match my bank account. I mean, when there’s money assigned to future months, it makes it feels like it makes it weird or if there’s-
Linzy [00:16:01] Yeah, yes.
Heidi [00:16:03] So I get really confused. So then having the buffer line makes it really hard. So like I think I need a different system because it’s just mind confusing, boggling.
Linzy [00:16:13] Yeah! And this is part of it, right. Is like how do you make it tangible and clear for you, so that you can set a goal and you can see when you’re on track for it and you can know when you’ve reached it and when you no longer need to be working on that goal. Right. I’m hearing separate, separate bank accounts you already have in place with that, something they’ll be helpful for, for not just this goal, but other goals that you’re thinking about because you’re kind of like you’re moving into a different stage of your finances. Heidi, I think is is part of what’s happening. Right? Like I said, new level, new devil, where it’s like now you actually like have some money that you can push forward into the future or that you can earmark for certain goals. That has not been your situation. Right? So this is kind of like- now your systems need to adapt to the fact that you’re making more money and you get to do more things with that money.
Heidi [00:16:56] Like you mean creating a separate bank account for like the buffer? Like having a buffer account?
Linzy [00:17:02] Yeah, that would be an option. That’s thinking about like what would make your brain happy?
Heidi [00:17:07] That’s a one that feels very clear and it’s direct and it’s like. And then I use a spreadsheet to figure out my- how much to put into each account.
Linzy [00:17:15] Yes. Your profit first. Yeah.
Heidi [00:17:16] Yeah. Then I could just, like, add that to that and just pick a percentage and then it keeps going until we get to…
Linzy [00:17:25] Exactly. And then you’ll see – because it’s a separate bank account – you’re going to see when there’s $600 there. And then, you know, that goal is complete, that money is there. And then in the future, if you take vacation and you find that your OpEx is a little low that month because you’ve earned less, because you’ve been away, then you know that exactly what that OpEx buffer is for and you get to like draw that 100 bucks over to fill it back up and then you can replenish it again. So it gives you a very distinct pool of money over there to know when you have enough of that buffer, like when your buffer is complete.
Heidi [00:17:57] Right. Yeah. No, I like that. I just then have to be okay with I mean, I move money all round all the time, but there’s sometimes when like I put money in a certain account and feel like I can’t ever touch it. I think that’s more like my personal savings or my like a joint family savings account I have, my mom told me it’s my money and I’m like, it’s not my money. So there’s, like, just $2,000 that sits there for if I end up with a $0, then I can use it.
Linzy [00:18:26] That’s your role for yourself, which is probably not your mom’s role for it, I wouldn’t guess.
Heidi [00:18:31] It’s not. But like, I create these weird rules. I like being able to actually move it or like knowing maybe it’s not move it, but like more specifically knowing when do I move? It’s like, at what point of my expense account, when it gets below, like what number do I then use the buffer.
Linzy [00:18:53] And that’s something that like you can think through and decide, right. Like I’m hearing for you, emotionally, $500 has meaning. Right. So maybe it’s that you plan to have $500 sitting in that OpEx account and like there’s like kind of like OpEx you about account does its own thing. You’re going to fill it up, you’re going to pay out of it. But on months where you earn less because you’re working less, you’re away. Then if you see it dip below that 500, you can fill it up, you know, from your OpEx buffer account. And like part of it is like, as you say, Heidi, being really clear on when are you allowed to use that money. Because sometimes what can happen when we have more of like an anxious or scarcity relationship to money is that we can almost like hoard it. Like it’s like we put it away and then we’re like, I’m not allowed to touch it. I’m never allowed to touch it. Even if I’m in the hospital, I can’t touch it. And I’ve seen people do this that it’s like we need to make sure that we set clarity and intention around those buckets of money so it’s clear like it’s there to support you, right? It’s there to make your life better.
Heidi [00:19:46] Yeah. Yeah. I definitely have a little bit of that. A little bit of the like, Yeah, I would might be the person who ends up in the hospital and I’m like, I have to see a client because I don’t have any money. Yeah, I have $1600 sitting over there and.
Linzy [00:19:58] There’s $2,000 from your mom over here, too. Yeah.
Heidi [00:20:01] Actually, there is money somewhere, so.
Linzy [00:20:03] Yes. And that’s you know, that is something to be curious about. And I think this kind of also comes back to, you know, your bigger piece that we started with is, are you able to accept money into your life as something that makes your life better?
Heidi [00:20:17] That’s a good question. Mm hmm. I want to intellectually say, well, of course,.
Linzy [00:20:21] Yes. Logically.
Heidi [00:20:23] But then I have this like hesitation or the like, oh, can I? Am I actually open enough to allow money to flow in to actually support me? And I don’t know that I have an answer for that. Yeah, it’s a really I don’t know.
Linzy [00:20:36] Because something that I notice thinking about kind of what you described at the beginning of this situation where it’s like you have literally been in a place where you have not been able to pay for all your groceries. Right. You have like used food bank resources to live, to eat. Right. Yes. And so now because of these moves that you made in your business, which have been hard moves to make. Right. And which have taken work and like there’s been like I want to, again, just like recognize and validate the work that you’ve done to get where you are. Right? Because it has been hard, but now you are starting to see the impact of that and there’s more money and as you say, like you actually have money left in your business account now. Right. And what I’m hearing is there’s relief there. And you have acquired some things that you just like would not have been able to acquire before. Right. Like a nicer workspace for yourself? Yeah. Getting help. Having help of somebody to come in and, like, create more order in your life, like with a professional organizer. And, you know, something that I wonder is like, can that be okay?
Heidi [00:21:33] I think it’s okay. Like, I’m growing in the direction of it being okay, but also just noticing, I don’t even notice, but like a quick snap back or this like flashback or quick like, yeah, well I want it to be okay, but I also feel like I’m stuck in this other place if I don’t have enough money anymore because I spent. Because I bought these big things.
Linzy [00:21:57] Mm hmm. Yeah.
Heidi [00:21:58] All of them together. And they bought them all really close to each other. So like I don’t know why I did that.
Linzy [00:22:04] Yeah.
Heidi [00:22:04] Well, in, like, a week, I was like, I want new stuff in my life. I can’t handle this, like-
Linzy [00:22:09] Yeah! Okay. There you go. So that that is my question. So why did you do that? Why did you buy all these things within a week from each other to, like, dig even more? What compelled you to do that?
Heidi [00:22:17] Let’s see. So I went to the store to get a new chair because my back has just been so messed up because the chair is just terrible. So, like, I actually wanted to support myself in a chair that-
Linzy [00:22:31] Physically. Yes, support yourself.
Heidi [00:22:31] Works my works for my body. It helps my spine. Yes. It’s like that’s the whole intention I went to the store. I had no intention of buying a desk. And when I was there, I just found a really cool desk. And I was like, oh, that’s really cool. And I had budgeted for the actual chair. So I felt like I was doing great with actually budgeting because I haven’t budgeted for things like that before in my life. When I want something, I just buy it if I have money. Right. Not thinking about the impacts that that might have later on of like, oh, you have to pay rent in a couple of weeks too.
Linzy [00:23:02] What that money was for, I guess.
Heidi [00:23:04] But then somehow it ended up into- so sitting in all the chairs, looking at the chairs, and then it’s like, Oh, I really like the desk. And then because the desk is a bigger desk than my other one, it kind of really only fits in one place, which is then why that the screen came in, right? Behind there, there’s kids toys and.
Linzy [00:23:21] Yeah, I understand. Yes.
Heidi [00:23:22] Right. Maybe don’t need to be seeing the kid’s toy like it could be distracting. Like, let’s have a calm environment. And then the person organizing literally just came because I was watching too many organizing shows, and it was like, I want to be on that show. Then it’s like, oh, there’s maybe people who live closer by. As I’m just looking at mess around my house. So that felt like a very emotional purchase.
Linzy [00:23:47] And with these purchases, Heidi, what’s the need that you were trying to meet?
Heidi [00:23:53] I want to be comfortable. That’s what comes up first. It’s like, I just want comfort. I just want ease. I just want it to work well or to flow. I definitely want things different in my life. There’s like a, if I buy new things, maybe that will make my feelings be different. Maybe I don’t have to be sick all the time. I mean, this isn’t logical, but like having a kid, you’re sick all the time. You feel like crap all the time. But I just want to not feel like crap. Like, what can I do to not feel crappy? Right. If I had a clean environment, that might help it. It’s really hard to keep it up. As a single mom.
Linzy [00:24:27] Absolutely. Yes.
Heidi [00:24:29] Like if I had a better organizational system, it might help. Just like relieve some of the pressure, some of the anxiety or some of the, like, constant Ugh that I live in. That’s the best I got. Something like that.
Linzy [00:24:41] Yeah. And I mean, that makes a lot of sense. And, you know, like another word that I heard, like where you start with the chair is like support. You know, you need more support. Right. And sounds like you’re you’re needing more support. You’re needing a little bit more order. You’re needing support in terms of having somebody come in and help you to create some more order in your life and like, you know, I will I will reflect to you, Heidi, like you’re a solo parent that’s- you’ve been a solo parent from the very beginning. This is your experience in parenthood. I will tell you that my partner and I, as two people parenting, look at each other all the time and are like solo parents are fucking incredible. Parenting with two adults to one child is hard enough. Right. And so I want to reflect that to you. Like it makes a lot of sense that at this point in your life you are seeking like support and and order and organization because it’s a very messy, demanding, germy, sicky, tears and not-a-lot-of-sleep time of life.
Heidi [00:25:32] Yeah. And I’m crazy enough to be like. And I’m doing it again soon.
Linzy [00:25:36] Pronto.
Heidi [00:25:38] You know? Whatever.
Linzy [00:25:39] I know biology is incredible, but. Yeah, so, like, reflecting that back at you, I mean.
Heidi [00:25:44] That also just clicked in my head of how I, with money, can also be that support in my account and I can see it. That could be really helpful. Like knowing that it’s there to actually use. That money is to be used and then it flows back in. That’s another like- I know I have like 18 million things, but when I- so I’ve been- I had to take some out of my savings account like a significant amount. So now I only have like $400 or $500 in there, which I don’t like that number, I would rather have like at least 1500 in my savings account. Sure. Yeah. So, like, that number is low. So like, my plan is like, I’m going to be refilling that to get that back up to where I need it to be. And it actually should probably be much higher than that. It should be. That’s just my comfortable number. It should just be three months or two months of expenses, which is like ideally, like $10,000. Like, I don’t know how you ever have this much money. I don’t know how you can get there, but like not even really knowing how to start building those buffers or how to start building that back in. Like when I do take from one place to pay bills. Yeah. And both accounts are low, so it feels like the priority needs to be the checking account or like the OpEx account before additional stuff. But then it feels like I’m going to be putting like $30 in these additional accounts and it’s like it’s going to take forever.
Linzy [00:27:06] Yes. And this is where I think getting a sense of your priorities and how these things kind of fit together. Right. Because it I think that especially given your situation where like you are the person bringing money into the household, right. If you’re not sending money home, money is not appearing. That like, this is it. So, you know, going back to that piece of like money supporting you, is your money really supporting you? If you’re prioritizing so much, getting two months ahead in your business budget, that you’re, you know, not eating well or feeling deprived at home? Probably not. So, I mean, this is something to think about, maybe coming back to this piece of identifying that like you’re looking for support and order, and like what you are looking for your money to bring into your life. Once you’re clear that this is what you need at this stage of life, because it’s also chapters, right? In different chapters of our life, like money, it has different potential and possibilities for us. But when you’re really clear on what’s important to you right now, then you can make a plan from that place of understanding how your money serves you best, right? So if you know that it’s about what what word – if we’re going to synthesize the words down into like one idea – what is the most valuable thing that money can be doing for you in your life right now, Heidi?
Heidi [00:28:12] There’s two words that, I mean, that come up. It’s the support and nourish.
Linzy [00:28:16] So support and nourish, right? So coming from that place, thinking about, okay, how can your money that you’re earning more and you’re building up more of that income, how can that money be really supporting and nourishing you in your different needs and then making a plan for the money to reach that? Right. So like that’s the emotional piece is looking at how can money support and nourish you. And then you get to make a budgetary plan, a numbers plan for how you prioritize these things when money does show up, right? So when money comes into your world, what are the basic goals you want to be hitting? Like how much goes to maternity leave every month? You know, how important is that compared to what’s the number that you want to make sure you hit in your groceries every month. Because I know groceries are such an important thing and you have experienced not being able to buy the groceries that really nourish you, right? So groceries and then replenishing your OpEx, you know, buffer is is part of it. But that should never take precedence over you actually being well. Right. Because you’re the machine that makes all of this happen. If you’re not well, none of this is going to happen.
Heidi [00:29:16] That’s helpful. Thank you for saying that, because I totally would be the person who would be like, well, the goal is to build the the buffer. So like I have to build the buffer, which means the only place I could take it from is my pay.
Linzy [00:29:28] Yes. Nope, nope, nope, nope, nope. Don’t do that. The purpose of your business is to support you in being well and allow you to thrive so that you can be a fucking amazing therapist who changes people’s lives. Right? Like there’s a loop there. And if we cut it off, and if we don’t let our business like let money flow into our life, and if we don’t let ourselves be well, and if we don’t let ourselves thrive, then we’re actually, like, starving the business, right? Because we’re starting to decrease our ability to, like, show up and be our best and be creative and increase our impact and call our people and all of the things that need to happen to keep that money flowing and to keep those clients being served.
Heidi [00:30:04] Right. Right. Yeah, I have a very big narrative that is not just about money, but about so much other stuff. Talking to my therapist about it a little bit today, but I thought of like, there’s never going to be enough. There’s never going to be enough to meet my needs specifically. So like. There’s not enough time to meet my needs. There’s not enough money. So it’s like if I really was going to be nourished, what that might look like is that if I go to the chiropractor and I’ve been trying to budget for going every other week, so going two times a month, but I actually need to be going every week because when I don’t go every week, it’s problems. Like she’s like you need to come every week, at least for right now. That increases that bill. Then there’s other dreams. Like it would be great to also get a massage regularly. I did have one recently, but the one before that was like six months ago.
Linzy [00:30:57] Yes, yes, yes.
Heidi [00:30:58] It’s like it’s a full extra thing right now. Like, so like there’s those kinds of things and then the like the grocery bill just seems to keep getting bigger. And I don’t understand how. And I, I want to eat really healthy and well food, but I honestly don’t have energy for it. So, like, I’m buying Amy’s frozen dinners cuz it’s like what can I microwave and fast?
Linzy [00:31:20] Yeah. Yep, for sure. And I mean something that- it’s risen in my mind that may or may not resonate with you. But this idea of maybe like creating like Heidi’s nourishment plan and it’s like writing out for the month. These are all the things that can nourish me. Right. And then looking at the money that you have and it’s a budget, in a sense, but it’s from that perspective of how do you get fed physically, how do you have your pain cared for, you know, like physically, how are you nourished, your food. And starting to think about how do you distribute this money that you’ve generated through your gifts? How do you distribute that to kind of get the the most potential out of it, knowing that not everything might be able to happen right now, but thinking about how can it have the most impact for you where it is right now, which also gives you the potential to grow your impact later as you have the potential to grow your business more or have different types of offers or whatever you want to do. What do you think about that, that idea of kind of approaching it that way and being curious about your numbers that way?
Heidi [00:32:21] I really love that. I actually did a whole big Phew in my head, like, not just my numbers, but like nourish my life. And what is that? And like, some of those things are going to have financial costs like groceries and the chiropractor and massages and whatever. But some of them aren’t. Like hanging out with my friends, my mom friends, hanging out with some friends who maybe don’t have kids, going for a cup of coffee with somebody who I really enjoy, that has a small impact, $5 or whatever.
Linzy [00:32:53] Yeah, exactly. But emotionally, it might have quite a large impact in terms of nourishing you.
Heidi [00:32:57] Yeah. Like that. There’s other things I could do that could also go into some of my- like the organizing thing I’m doing is like wanting to create a little space for me, a little sacred space a little- a chair where I can read and journal. That’s like, this is my space to recharge and I so desperately need that as I like- I’m about to tear up just thinking about it like.
Linzy [00:33:18] Absolutely.
Heidi [00:33:18] Yes. Oh, yeah. We need more nourishing, so much more in my life. If my money can support that, that would be like ideal. And that it actually can if I just think my way through it.
Linzy [00:33:32] Yeah exactly. And I think when you take that lens with it too, like if you spend time to be actively thinking about nourishment and noticing nourishment, it also deepens the experience that you have of it. When you do have that coffee with that friend, knowing that you’re like, okay, this is my chance to connect. This is my chance to say the things I haven’t been able to say or catch up or whatever certain friends give to you. I think also when we’re more present with those experiences, they’re more impactful, right? Like they fill us up more when we let ourselves like really drink in what it is that we need from them. And then in some ways we end up needing to spend less money because we’re more filled up and we’re doing less of that, like fast spending to just like relieve pain. Because I notice myself, at least, even though I consider myself like an ambivalent, I’m like in the middle of the spectrum when we see friends on an evening, even during the week, if I’m like so tired and I drag myself and we see friends, the next morning, even if I’ve slept less, I’m more energetic, I’m more creative, I’m more able to do things. Like it actually creates energy, which decreases my need to like buy a drink out, grab pizza for dinner because I’m like, God, I can’t. Right. Like, it actually saves you money to be more fulfilled.
Heidi [00:34:40] That’s so true. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And I meditated the other day after having a really, really tough morning with my kiddo, so I was just, like, about to fall apart. Sat down, I was like, I’m going to sit down and just check in with myself. I did that and my entire day shifted, and I was like, I’m okay. Yeah, I’m good. I actually felt more nourished.
Linzy [00:34:59] Yes. So I mean, there’s 75 other things we could talk about, but I’m going to start drawing us towards wrapping up. So, you know, Heidi, coming into the end of our conversation today, what sticks out for you? What are you taking away?
Heidi [00:35:13] Well, I think there’s a couple of things. Is one that like looking at the things that I need to nourish, like I actually want to write them down and like put it on a little tool, almost like a little vision board or something. Nourishing things. And like let that also be a creative, nourishing thing to think about it because I feel some creative energy around that. And then also to work on building buffers for my operating expenses so that I have money to draw on when I get to a place where I might want to buy something a little bit bigger. And that it can be there and it doesn’t have to be so unknown of, Do I have enough money? Or because I operate like almost too close to like a budgeted like- so I know exactly like every single thing that’s going to come out of that month. And so I have my operating expenses are like $50 more than that. It’s like I’m operating really close to.
Linzy [00:36:09] All very tight.
Heidi [00:36:10] Yes. Yeah. What needs to be in there? So, like, to increase that in a different space that I really know what I have, I think that would be helpful. The nourishing one is definitely like I think overall a bigger emotional impact, which might help to get to that other goal.
Linzy [00:36:26] Yeah. Because it makes you think about, I mean it makes a lot of sense to me that you are seeking nourishment so much. And I think we can see that by like when you had the opportunity, you’re like, there’s these things I’ve been needing and I just need to like have order and I need to have support and I need to have a chair that doesn’t hurt my body. Right? There’s this need there. And then also, though, as we start to actually fulfill that real need, which is the need to be fed, which money helps us with, and money makes possible, but money isn’t the only way that that happens. Then from there you can start to be more intentional, more planful about how you want to start to work towards these other other important goals and you know, take some paid time off too, which, check out Money Skills module five for that by the way, the paycheck and time off, go back and dig into that now that there’s more money to play with.
Heidi [00:37:08] Yeah, definitely need it come holidays because I’m not in daycare and well, I have to be her mom.
Linzy [00:37:14] Yes. Exactly. Exactly. Yes. Yes. So thank you so much, Heidi, for coming. And talking with me today.
Heidi [00:37:22] Thank you so much. This was lovely.
Linzy [00:37:36] In my conversation today with Heidi, it felt like when we got to the point of sinking into talking about why she was spending this money, that we really got into the root of it. And I think that’s such a good question for all of us to ask ourselves when we notice certain behaviors coming up around money, like spending a lot of money or not spending money is asking yourself like, what is the need that I’m trying to meet here? There are so many ways that money can help us meet our needs. And in Heidi’s case, it was this need for nourishment. You know, money literally can be turned into food that nourishes your body, right? It can be turned into health care that takes care of your body. So there is all these ways that money can help us meet our real needs, and yet also our needs can be met in other ways that are not just about money. And we don’t need to rely on money to meet all of those needs. So that example that she gave of like having coffee with a friend might cost her $5, but the impact of that on her need to be nourished is going to be quite great by probably a lot more than, you know, your average $5. So when we can start to really identify what our real needs are and a lot of ways it gives us so much more depth in our experience of money, because when we are meeting our needs with money, we can really let ourselves take in and notice that our needs are being met. And also it was through our efforts, you know, and the work that we did in the world that allowed us to earn the money to meet these needs. That’s a really beautiful way of receiving kind of the fruits of your labor. But it does also mean that you can identify other ways that those needs do need to be met so that we don’t throw money at needs that that money will not solve. Right. And that’s so often the case that we are feeling lonely or unloved or not good enough. And so we spend money in ways that maybe gives us like a quick dopamine hit, like buying some beautiful thing. And it does make you feel good for, you know, when you first order it and maybe when it first arrives, but it very quickly it stops having impact and we can spend hundreds or thousands of dollars trying to get our needs met. That way, when we really identify our true needs, it does just give us so much more opportunity for mastery or intention with money, because then we’re attending to what really needs attention rather than kind of throwing money at things that maybe money can’t always help us solve. If you want to hear more from me, you can follow me on Instagram @moneynutsandbolts. We are posting free practical and emotional money content on there all the time. I always say free. Of course, you know Instagram is free, but it feels important to mention that. And if you’re enjoying the podcast, please head over to Apple Podcasts and leave me a review. I’ve said it so many times, but it remains true. It is the best way for other therapists who would benefit from these conversations to find me. Thanks for listening today.