Nyssa [00:00:01] You are actually the perfect teacher for your perfect students, which has nothing to do with being perfect. It just means that your unique constellation of experiences and trainings and degrees and humanity and just natural gifts and personality – when all of those things come together. You are actually the best teacher for the people who are made to learn from you.
Linzy [00:00:28] Welcome to the Money Skills For Therapists podcast, where we answer this question: How can therapists and health practitioners go from money shame and confusion, to feeling calm and confident about their finances and get money really working for them in both their private practice and their lives? I’m your host Linzy Bonham, therapist turned money coach and creator of the course Money Skills For Therapists. Hello and welcome back to the podcast. My guest today is Nyssa Brown. So Nyssa is a teacher by training and now she has turned her teaching superpowers to helping busy therapists increase their impact and get out of that 1 to 1 time for money equation by turning their expertize into profitable online courses. She’s been a teacher for more than 20 years, and she’s coached therapists, educators, and course creators on six continents, sharing their expertize and creating courses that transform them, their students, and their businesses. And I think you’re really going to see and feel Nyssa’s expertize come through in our conversation today. We really got into the how of turning what you know into a course, not just kind of the what and the options, but really that kind of like embodied experience and the steps to go through to actually turn what you know as a therapist or health practitioner into a course. She talked about why therapists actually make great teachers. Some of the overlaps that we have that make teaching very natural for therapists. And how imperfect is exactly what your students need from you when you’re creating a course. And then at the end of our time together, we get into the actual steps of turning what you know into a mini course very concretely. So some really helpful action steps to take away. Very thoughtful, interesting conversation with Nyssa. Enjoy my conversation with Nyssa Brown.
Linzy [00:02:29] Nyssa, welcome to the podcast.
Nyssa [00:02:30] Thank you, Linzy. I’m so happy to be here. Thanks for having me.
Linzy [00:02:33] I’m so glad to have you here. So your zone of genius, your expertize, is in helping therapists turn what they know – they’re gifts – into courses, which is something that probably some therapists who are listening have probably thought about a little bit before, because as therapists, we do run into this problem where it’s kind of like there’s only so many people we can see in the course of a week. So we might have like our gift, our thing that we do really well, that we’re really passion about. But one on one, there’s only so much work that we can ever do with folks in that area that we’re so experienced and skilled.
Nyssa [00:03:08] Absolutely.
Linzy [00:03:09] You help folks then turn that into courses. Is that correct?
Nyssa [00:03:13] Courses and programs. So helping therapists take their their zone of genius, their expertize and increase their impact while hopefully conserving some of their energy and potentially increasing their income as well.
Linzy [00:03:26] Yeah. Okay, beautiful. So we were chatting a little bit beforehand that we’re going to have another episode this season that gets more into like the what of like different options. So today we want to lean more into like the how of like, what does this look like?
Nyssa [00:03:39] Awesome.
Linzy [00:03:40] You know, how do therapists kind of like become teachers? And I know that you have this idea that actually therapists are natural teachers. Can you tell me a bit about that?
Nyssa [00:03:49] Yeah, absolutely. So we have a pretty strong research base within education. So I’m a career long teacher. I’m a good 25 years in at this point, working with pre-K through grad school and a lot of teacher education. And the research that we have on relationships being the foundation for learning is compelling and therapists are incredible at building relationships. So when that relationship is in place, people will learn almost anything from us, right? And I’m sure therapists, any therapist who is listening, has been in that situation where you realize, wow, this person and I really are connecting right now. And the transformation because of that is exponential. If that connection weren’t there, the transformation couldn’t be there as well. And so from my perspective, therapists build on that skill of transformation via that super power of relationship. And so that’s- it’s just such a naturally honed piece of being a therapist. And I should say natural, but also a practice to skill, not to be taken for granted. So when I when I say therapists are natural born teachers, that’s what I mean, because the relationships are the foundation of that transformation.
Linzy [00:05:04] That’s really interesting. I mean, that makes my brain go in all different directions. But certainly I remember when I was in grad school, there’s this research on kind of the common factors of what makes therapy successful. And like one of the top factors is just like trust and connection. Right? Like that’s such a big part. Like regardless of what models you’re using or the language that you’re working on, if there is that like real authentic connection, right, and trust between you, that’s very transformative. And it sounds like teaching is very similar in that way.
Nyssa [00:05:33] Yes, absolutely. I always say that people will learn anything from you if they trust you. It’s pretty powerful.
Linzy [00:05:39] Right. So then as therapists, like with that skill set that we have of building relationships, knowing how- I think also like we know how to maintain and repair relationships because that’s also part of relationships. Because, as a therapist, you know what to do when you’re like, Oh, I said the wrong things on the wrong direction, you know, like we have the skill to kind of keep people online right in various ways. And that’s something that very naturally I’m hearing can be beneficial when we want to expand and start kind of teaching what we know, not just doing the therapy work that we know how to do.
Nyssa [00:06:09] Yes, absolutely.
Linzy [00:06:11] What I can hear, though, some therapist saying is, like when you’re in that one on one space with somebody, there is that connection. And like, maybe there’s room for mistakes because you have like so much time with something. Right. So I’m just kind of thinking through like the folks that have taken my course and like people who I know are like so skilled and so amazing what they do, but they don’t necessarily know that, right? Because like we sit in rooms, kind of like by ourselves having these private conversations. And I think there’s all sorts of ways that like a therapist can make up stories about how like, well, you know, it works, but it’s only because of this or it’s only because of that. Like, well, we’re pretty hard ass, is what I’m saying. Yes, we tend to be achiever types. We notice what we don’t do well and we probably fixate on that. Yes, we probably disregard a lot of what we’re good at. And something that I notice is sometimes that’s a barrier for people to kind of honor or think that they can do this work in some other way. Right. Think that they could have a course or workshop. So what is your thought on that? Like for therapists who struggle with kind of their imperfection or being perfectionistic, not being where they want to be, that being a bit of a barrier sticking out their neck a little bit?
Nyssa [00:07:17] Yeah, absolutely. I fully and completely understand that sort of leaning towards perfectionism. It’s something that I definitely deal with on a daily basis. So I have a lot of empathy for it and a lot of compassion for it in others as well as I try to in myself. So I totally get that and I think I try to because it is a daily practice. I think the thing that I notice in everyone that I work with and that’s – this is true of whether I’m working in professional development with teachers or if I’m working with therapists who are creating courses or programs – we tend to completely take for granted what we know. And there’s this sense that if I know it, then everyone else knows it.
Linzy [00:07:55] Yes.
Nyssa [00:07:55] And I’ve done it to myself and I’ve seen it for decades. I’m not kidding you. I’ve been doing adult professional development and teacher leadership for decades. And I watched people do it before they present workshops. Before they present courses. Everyone always assumes that everything they know, everyone else knows because how could they not? It’s so familiar to us. And therapists are, you know, in my experience, notoriously self-aware and able to say, Well, of course that doesn’t make sense. Just because I know it doesn’t mean everyone else knows it. But that’s a cognitive response. When we’re in that moment of I don’t know if I have anything to say in the course. I mean, I don’t know if I’m good enough, frankly, or I don’t know if my constellation of experiences is course worthy. And my response to that is usually just to mirror that back, first of all, and just say, this is such a common thing to take for granted. What would we know? But let me say to you, and it’s usually by this point, we’re usually relatively at least knee deep in their content as I’m coaching them on how to organize their content. And I’ll be like, Listen, the number of things that you’ve said already that I don’t know is like a mountain, and we’ve just gotten started, so you can assume that, right? And that’s an authentic reflection from me. And then the next piece that I usually talk about is that we take for granted not just what we know, not just our degrees or our various trainings or certifications, but also the experiences that we’ve had that make us uniquely able to create a network of ways that things connect in ways that are transformative to people. And I think in the therapy space, that probably seems maybe more approachable, right? Like I understand when I put things together for for my clients in certain ways based on their background experiences, they can experience healing or transformation. But the same thing is true when we’re teaching as well. Teaching is transformation in its own way. It’s transforming learning. It’s building on what people know and helping them move further. So I always say that you are actually the perfect teacher for your perfect students. Yes. Which has nothing to do with being perfect. It just means that your unique constellation of experiences and trainings and degrees and humanity and just natural gifts and personality, when all of those things come together, you are actually the best teacher for the people who are made to learn from you. And as a matter of fact, I’ll take it one step further and see that other people who may have more degrees or more trainings would be worse teachers for your perfect teacher because you are the person who will resonate with them most because exactly of who you are. And that’s my experience time and time again in working with people is that that’s where people learn. It goes back to that relationship piece, right? When we connect, we can be open enough to learn and transform.
Linzy [00:10:54] Yeah. And I mean I love hearing you say that. And I’m hearing echoes of I’ve said that phrase before, but more to teach a therapist when they’re in Money Skills For Therapists and we’re kind of looking at like the value of their work. And like I see someone who is so passionate about a certain topic, but not only that, they’re educated on it, they have certain experiences, they have a certain energy and way about them. And it’s like nobody can serve the people you serve in the way that you do. Just literally nobody on Earth, because nobody on earth has your unique combination of traits and experiences.
Nyssa [00:11:23] Yes.
Linzy [00:11:23] And so I completely agree with you. And I think that I see how therapists struggle with sometimes owning that in the therapy space, which in some ways is very private, safe space, I would say. That’s certainly been my experience of moving from being a therapist to like an online course creator and like kind of more of a public teacher is like it’s scarier to do it in front of everybody.
Nyssa [00:11:43] Yes!
Linzy [00:11:43] It’s scarier to do it when you have like 50 students in your course at one time or when you’re teaching public facing, you know, like on Instagram or a podcast or you’re running some sort of public event, you know, like there’s a lot more exposure there, but it’s, it’s the same thing where it’s like that unique combination that you have, literally nobody has. And for the folks who connect with you and find you, and they’re like, Oh my gosh, this person is the person I’ve been looking for. There literally isn’t anybody else like you, which also means that if you’re not offering it and if you’re not putting it out there, then – I say this to my students sometimes – you’re depriving people of the opportunity of having a- if we’re kind of hiding and staying small because we’re waiting to be perfect when what I’m hearing from you is being perfect is actually not at all what needs to happen to be great teachers and to have folks. Probably the opposite actually.
Nyssa [00:12:29] Being real and vulnerable. That’s what people resonate with. Right. If you if you’re kind of a stone face, everything looks great from the outside, you know, perfection. I personally, that’s hard for me to resonate with because that’s not me. Right. And so and I find that when people- when I’m real, people say, thank you for just being honest about that, that’s harder. Thank you for just being real about that didn’t work for you the first time or that it didn’t go well the first time you tried that. And that’s- there’s just something so permission-giving and beautiful in that.
Linzy [00:12:58] Totally. And it makes you think too. Like for some of the topics that folks who are listening, that might be their course topic that would make sense for them, often too we are working with folks around vulnerability right? Like we’re working with folks around pregnancy loss or caregiver fatigue or, you know, raising a kid with complex needs. Those are very vulnerable experiences where we feel our human failings and where we tell ourselves that we’re not good enough. And I think when we show up as a as a therapist or a teacher – and we’re putting these things side by side right now, they’re so similar – as perfect, and we don’t let a little bit of our authentic self come through as appropriate, right, it’s not your therapy session. That’s not your course to learn. It’s their’s. You know, but when we all share those things kind of thoughtfully, we do kind of in some ways reinforce the story that they might have, that they’re the only one who’s struggling with this, that they’re never going to figure this out because you obviously have to figure it out from start and you’re perfect, like it actually can reinforce and blocks connection and relationship.
Nyssa [00:13:55] Exactly. Yeah, exactly.
Linzy [00:13:57] You had just mentioned earlier one of the key ingredients of folks learning where the key ingredient is relationship. Like if they can’t authentically connect with you and see themself in you and feel safe with you, they can’t really learn from you.
Nyssa [00:14:08] Yes, absolutely. And one of the things that I dive deeper with than anyone has ever asked me to dive deeply when I start working with clients, is is a series of questions about who are you? What were your most transformative experiences? What makes you unique? Why are you here? And then ask sort of similar questions about who do you serve and who are you uniquely qualified to serve? Who learns from you? Who comes to you naturally already? And then ask some questions about and how do we put those two things together in a way that you uncover and own the gifts that are yours? And that’s pre-work for the VIP days that I offer. But people show up on those VIP days almost 100% of the time and see those reflections are changing. How I’m looking at this course that I want to create because I know me better, I own me better. And I also have seen the people I’m trying to serve through a different lens. So I think there’s something really, really important, the work that we do before we think about the content even, right? That helps us to know how we can serve in a way that no one else can. And that’s our gift, right?
Linzy [00:15:21] Yes. And I can see how having that as your foundation that you build your course on is so powerful, right. Because you’re getting out of- in some ways it seems to me like you’re starting with heart instead of with head, which is very much how I like to teach. And what I do in Money Skills For Therapists is like we start with the body and the heart because like there’s so much wisdom there. And there’s also – in the case of what I teach with money skills – like there can be so much like shame or overwhelm there that that locks the head, right? Like we need to take care of all of these things. And I’m hearing from you, by really connecting with that and that kind of like embodied wisdom and that like who you are, what matters, then you can build content on top of it that is going to be so much more effective because you’re really connected to kind of like the deeper meanings or the, you know, the deeper importance of it rather than just facts and information, which facts and information can bounce off if the soil hasn’t been prepared properly.
Nyssa [00:16:12] That’s such a beautiful way to say it. I think one of the other stories that we tell ourselves as well, I mean, if I have a course to create or a program to create, somebody else has already done it.
Linzy [00:16:20] Yes. Yes.
Nyssa [00:16:22] And and that’s a safe story to tell ourselves. Right. Like, that’s a way to let ourselves off the hook from something scary. But if we take that step back and we say, who am I and who am I uniquely qualified to serve? How do those things come together? And then we put content on that. There’s nobody that will ever have a course like yours because it came from a place that is so authentic to you that only you could create it. And I think that that’s a powerful place to stand. I’m kind of like putting my feet on the floor, as I say, that that’s a powerful place to stand, as a facilitator of learning when that can come through you, because it’s the most authentic thing to you. And when our students receive that, it feels completely different than something that was just simply crafted between our ears.
Linzy [00:17:10] Absolutely. Yes. Yes. Because I think like learning also needs to happen on that level. Right? Like, yeah, intellectual information – especially like when we’re talking about the types of courses that students are going to building like this – is not astrophysics that we’re talking about courses about. Right. This is going to be courses that are very much probably about like human experience, and human emotion, and human abilities, as we said. So that seems like such an essential component, which I’m sure can get missed a lot if you don’t really intentionally bring that into building your course.
Nyssa [00:17:40] Yeah, it’s easy to go to the intellectual. It’s also safer.
Linzy [00:17:44] It is safer. Yes, absolutely. Yeah.
Nyssa [00:17:46] Not necessarily the most impactful and not necessarily the most powerful. But safer. So it takes some courage on the part of a course creator or a learning facilitator to go there and ask some of those questions. But if there’s anybody who’s up to the to the challenge, it’s therapists hundred percent.
Linzy [00:18:03] So, yes, and that’s I mean, that’s interesting to me when you say that it’s safer because like I’m a trauma therapist by training. That’s the work that I did before I stopped practicing and just do Money Skills For Therapists now. And it makes me think about, you know, there’s this concept of like wise mind or like being in a window of tolerance and that’s when you’re rooted in present. And for that, you both your body and brain need to be online. And I think what’s safer about just jumping to facts when we’re teaching, trying to teach, just the best of the information is it’s a bit disconnected. Right. We don’t- we’re not feeling that like vulnerability of it, which is part of learning and it’s part of life. And so I just got to thinking about like, right, that’s wise mind. That’s when we are really in self is when we have both the emotions and the embodied experience and the brain online. And that’s where like integration and learning happens as much as sometimes it’s harder because it’s you feel more of the feelings, right? We’re not just like letting people hide in their intellect. It’s not intellectualized, right? It’s actually like a fully present experience.
Nyssa [00:18:59] And where synergy can happen.
Linzy [00:19:01] Right? Yes. Yes.
Nyssa [00:19:02] That’s when more than we thought was possible can happen is when we’re aligned like that for ourselves, but also for our students.
Linzy [00:19:10] Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. So for folks who are listening and they’re like, okay, this sounds good, I’m kind of convinced that I have something to offer and that I should bring, you know, like myself to the table and like my emotions and experiences when I’m crafting this curriculum. How do folks get started on like thinking about packaging up what they know is for many course, what are what are the steps for that?
Nyssa [00:19:31] Yeah, I think starting with that, those questions about who am I and what am I meant to teach, why am I here? What matters to me? If I were to ask someone else what makes me unique? And that’s a great question. By the way, it takes a lot of courage to ask someone, how do you perceive me in terms of my unique abilities or my unique combination of abilities? Obviously, ask a person who’s going to be a safe distance.
Linzy [00:19:59] Don’t ask your mean neighbor. You’re not going to like it.
Nyssa [00:20:03] Exactly. But it’s really starting with some of those questions about the self and having some courage to say, you know, if I were going to create a course, what would matter enough for me to put together a program or a course? Right. And, you don’t have to start with the most vulnerable part of yourself on your first course, I’m not saying that. But, you know, just so you can show up with the kind of energy that will make you want to finish creating the course and will also be most transformative for your students. Right. And then also taking a look then also at who our students are, which I said earlier as well, who in your experience, have you had the most synergy with? Have you had the most transformations with? Who can you help the best and who are those people? And then where does who you are and who they are come together? And then that’s the heart sort of space that we want to start in. And once we have a sense of that and we can get a little more tactical, this is where my curriculum nerd comes out. My curriculum design nerd, are you ready? Start to think about, you know, what would be the goals of a program or a course that you would teach. And so we talk a lot about backward design in the education space, and that’s certainly not unique to education, but thinking about what are the goals like what’s the finish line, right? Like what, what will people know differently, be able to do differently, understand differently? And perhaps most importantly, this is sort of one of my broken record things is what will they be able to apply after they’re done? Like, what will they actually be able to do in their real life outside of this course as a result of the course?
Linzy [00:21:35] Yeah.
Nyssa [00:21:35] Those get to be sort of the end goals. And once we know what those end goals are, I really recommend sort of with those end goals in mind just doing a – and this is a challenge even for me – a non perfectionistic brain dump of everything that you know that relates to those things. So in relationship to the goals, just start writing or typing or whatever works for you or drawing or painting, whatever it is that gets all of these ideas. What do you know? What frameworks do you use? What resources do you use? What online quizzes could it could be helpful. Who are the guest speakers? What books have you read? How about articles? Any journals that are on this? Like literally just get everything that could be helpful in the service of those goals in one place and then start to look for chunks like if I could start to put those ideas, activities, topics into some kinds of chunks. Those chunks can become modules.
Linzy [00:22:35] Mm. Yes.
Nyssa [00:22:36] And it could be like start here, then do this next, then do this next. Like module one, two, and three. And it often is. If it’s more sort of just knowledge based, it might be like module one is one topic. Module two is another topic. Module three is another topic, right? And that’s a more sort of knowledge based or I want you to know these three frameworks, but then at some point you probably want to teach people how to apply them. So maybe module four is application, right? So basically once we know our goals, we dump out everything that we know in service of those goals and then we start to organize them in chunks. We have a decent outline for what- a course that could start to take shape. And then, you know, how we organize within those modules and potentially lessons. How people learn gets to be a bit more granular, but those first few steps are pretty powerful in empowering because people say, Oh gosh, I first of all, I know something. I know way more some things than I thought I did. Yeah. And hey, look, they kind of fit together in a way that might be helpful to people, and I know what I want them to take away in the end. Yes. And once you get that, you’re kind of vulnerable up over Boulder downhill at that point, right? You’re like, hey, maybe I can do this, right? And that’s usually what people need in order to say, yeah, when the time is right for me to create a program or course, yeah, this, this will work, right? So those are my introductory steps recommendations.
Linzy [00:24:00] But I mean, I love what that brings up too, because I think that as long as you let yourself flow with that and like don’t censor yourself and just like let it truly be just like put it all out, you will see that you probably know a lot more than you think you do. And I will say for a lot of folks listening, you probably know more than you can fit in one course.
Nyssa [00:24:19] 100%.
Linzy [00:24:20] Because I think that’s something that I’ve seen and certainly that I’ve worked on and thought about as I look to build other things after Money Skills For Therapists is it can be tempting sometimes to put everything, you know into like a six week course. And the reality is you probably know way more, way more than can fit in a six week course, right? So it’s almost like you might realize, okay, I know this much and I can actually only teach a small portion of that. What’s the starting point, which I would hope if people do this process – and I encourage people actually do it – would be also a good reminder of like, you know a lot. You have a lot to teach. You could do more than one course in you by letting yourself just like see everything that is in your brain.
Nyssa [00:25:00] Well, and what usually happens is once people get on a roll a little bit, one of the first questions I always when I work with people, I always ask is, what’s the green size of this? Like, is this going to be a workshop is going to be a 90 minute workshop that you’re working on? Or are we talking about some kind of like a signature course that could be six to 9 to 12 weeks depending on. And then, you know, obviously we craft according to that. But what people then start to see is they start to see more than like, oh gosh, I do have more than one course in me. And then we start to see transformation not just from session to session with clients, but we start to see through that idea of like a more of a customer journey, right? Well, I could create a 90 minute workshop that would help people get to know how I work and what’s important. And then maybe I’ll do some kind of a mini course. And those two would be related, but not the same. Yeah. And that mini course then really could prepare people for that bigger signature, six to 9 to 12 week course. That would be the most robust transformation. But then after that, there are certain deep dives that could be like advanced trainings on things that we could really only sort of touch on in the signature framework. And so now after that, in the customer journey, you start to have more advanced trainings and deep dives, and people who used to think they didn’t have a course in them are all of a sudden looking at a customer journey that looks like that and like it feels like a whole new world. It’s really exciting to be a part of.
Linzy [00:26:19] Yeah. So I mean with this Nyssa for folks listening, to kind of make it feel more tangible, like we’re kind of talking about the how. Yeah, what about like examples for therapists like folks who are listening to this podcast are going to be mostly mental health therapists. We also have acupuncturists, physios, massage therapists, coaches. What would be some examples of some topics that you’ve seen or you would possibly see being really great for therapists to create kind of outside or in addition to the therapy work that they do.
Nyssa [00:26:49] The best topic for people is going to really depend on who they are, of course, it kind of comes back to right. And so I fully respect the question and I don’t mean to evade it, but so let me kind of let me walk that balance between giving some examples and also wanting to empower people to really stay reflective on what’s unique to them. So, you know, if we’re thinking about wanting to invite more people into our practice and maybe having a short training or something on our website that’s available, you know, thinking about like what’s our specialty, like you mentioned being a trauma therapist or a somatic therapist or an EFT therapist. And so what is it that you want people to see from you before they’re likely to book some kind of a consultation call or a discovery call of some kind, to potentially consider being one of your clients. So thinking about, you know, what is it that is a representation of who you are and how you work, not just in the techniques that you use, but also your approach that they can kind of see, see who you are and how you work with the techniques that you do. Right. So, you know, so that would be one example of sort of a way to to invite people into the practice. If you’re trying to build either your own practice or you’re trying to build a group practice to sort of help people see like, what do we do here? Who are we and what do we do? Right. I’ve also heard so many therapists talk about if I have to say the same thing one more time.
Linzy [00:28:10] Yes.
Nyssa [00:28:10] And it’s there’s sort of like this a body of knowledge that you want your- or a set of skills that you want your clients to have because you know how transformative they are. So creating a course that matches whatever that is that your clients could have access to, that would be a way for them to do that asynchronously, not during the 1 to 1 time, but that they could do outside of that time. So that, again, would go back to your specialty, would go back to, you know, is it about guided meditations? Is it about a somatic experience of some kind? Is it about just understanding the techniques that you use and where they come from? So that would be, you know, another approach. And then I work with group practice owners who have talked about, you know, just simply having courses that are onboarding courses. So that we don’t have to spend 1 to 1 human time of training for things that, you know, we just it’s the same for every person. So that’s a completely different approach than a therapeutic or supporting a therapeutic approach. Right. But it’s it’s very time saving and energy saving. Right. So I feel like there’s there’s a huge gamut of things that just give you. But I hope it triggers I hope it’s open enough for people that it sort of triggers in their mind, like, well, what would that be for me in my practice?
Linzy [00:29:22] Yes. Yeah.
Nyssa [00:29:23] So I hope that’s helpful.
Linzy [00:29:24] Yes. Because I’m hearing like those are all kind of examples that to me seem like those are different ways for folks to use like courses or workshops kind of in your clinical work that you’re currently doing, right. Like in your group practice, rather than training folks one on one, have like a course which really encapsules your approach as a practice and your practices and whatever. So that you know, when folks are being onboarded, they’re all going through the same quality training, right? So that sounds like a way to almost like streamline a process and probably a great quality of a process, right. You know that your new hire is going to get the same quality as your old hire. Even though you have the flu this week, they’re still going to get the same quality of training as the person you hired or having like as you say something on your website for folks to see can give them a sense of of how to work with you. What about people who are kind of thinking about doing something different like they’re kind of me, what is the course inside of you is like not your clinical work that you do, but you’ve got some other passion and or you want to expand. Can you speak a little bit to how you’ve seen therapists manage that situation?
Linzy [00:30:23] Yeah, absolutely. So I’ve worked with therapists also who are creating a second business really outside of their therapy license. Right. So I guess it now is probably a really good time just to say, you know, before creating any courses or any content like this, you definitely want to check in with your attorney and make sure that your what you’re creating works for your license and keeps your license safe and all of these things. So what I’m what I’m talking about right now is outside. And I think this is what you’re asking me, right, is something that we outside of a therapy license. So I’ve worked with folks to create like second businesses. So, for instance, I have a dear friend who is a therapist and also a copywriter. So she has created a copywriting course for therapists, actually. And so this this course is is brilliant and getting rave reviews. And she also separately in her other business under her therapy license, still sees clients a few days a week in addition to her separate copywriting business. So that would be an example of of how to do that separate from your therapy practice.
Linzy [00:31:22] Yeah. And I think like for mental health therapists, we were talking a little bit off mic before we started recording about how there are specific considerations for us when you’re doing mental health therapy because our licensure is- our colleges or regulatory bodies are stricter because we do have so much influence over clients. There’s like stricter code of ethics in terms of what we can do. So I know for me, when I made Money Skills For Therapists, I created a separate corporation for businesses. To be very clear, I am not being a social worker right now. This has nothing to do with my social working license. This is me being a business coach and a business consultant and having to keep that super clear. Because if I didn’t keep that very clear, the things that I do to actually promote Money Skills For Therapists are actually in violation of my social worker code of ethics. That’s also something for you to consider, folks who are listening. Like if you know that the courses in you is copywriting or teaching finances to therapists or something that is outside of what you do, making sure that you speak with a lawyer and set it up so it’s very clear if something that does not fit with your license is very distinctly separated from the work that you’re doing under your license because you have to keep mindful of that in our particular field.
Nyssa [00:32:30] Absolutely. Yeah. And I just I think that I’m sure that the people listening would also feel very comfortable to know that that was taken care of well. Right. That would be a comfort to you, that person involved. Exactly. So.
Linzy [00:32:47] Right. Well, Nyssa, for folks who want to get further into your world. Where’s the best place for them to find and follow the awesome?
Linzy [00:32:54] So my company is called Bespoke Curriculum Design and you can find that at Bespoke Curriculum dot com and there’s lots of information there and I am open to any questions along the way. If people have them, just, just shoot me a message. The contact information is there.
Linzy [00:33:10] And you mentioned earlier that VIP days are the main way you’re supporting folks right now. Yes. So if you want to do some deep dive work with Nyssa, help pull your brilliance out of you, which I feel like is this is the vibe I’m getting from you is this is part of what you do is you help to assess people’s brilliance and help them to see it’s both their kind of embodied experiential brilliance and their brain and their intellectual brilliance. So that is a way that you can get Nyssa’s supports. And is there anything- any freebies that you have or anything you’re offering that you want folks to know about?
Nyssa [00:33:41] Yes, absolutely. So I do have a freebie that has gotten really, really positive reviews. And it’s it’s a video training that’s similar to the process that I outlined today for outlining a mini course. And it’s called Mini Course Magic: Serve Clients, Save Energy. And I’m happy to give you the link and you can pass it on to folks. So 45 minute training and there’s a PDF that goes along with it that really sort of helps organize the things that we talked about today if you’re interested in doing that work.
Linzy [00:34:09] So thank you for that. So we will put the link for that in the show notes. So if you want to have a taste of working with Nyssa and kind of some support in organizing your your brilliance and our expertize, that sounds like a great resource. Thank you so much for coming on the podcast today.
Nyssa [00:34:23] Thank you for having me, Linzy. It was truly a pleasure to talk to you.
Nyssa [00:34:39] In my conversation with Nyssa, that piece about kind of bringing your embodied experience, your imperfections to creating, of course, I think there’s just so much wisdom in that. As I talked about, I really do believe that all of us just have something extremely unique to offer that literally nobody can offer in the way that you do. And Nyssa and I are definitely on the same page about that piece. And I think that by starting with your experiences and your imperfection and starting from who you are and who you want to serve, I can absolutely see how her approach that way creates this great foundation to then layer knowledge on top of, right. So much of what we do with our clients is so much more than like facts or information. It’s really about how to integrate these things in. And I just totally see the wisdom in what she’s talking about. A kind of like start- she didn’t say it like this, but the way that I’m thinking about it is like, start with the heart. And from there, you can build something really powerful for the folks that you love to serve. So I hope that this conversation today has been inspiring for those of you listening. Expansion has been a theme that I’ve been thinking about a lot as I’ve been building and launching a mastermind for folks who are graduates of Money Skills For Therapists and just how much we have to offer and how much impact we can make when we do start to build things out beyond 1 to 1 therapy. And that’s why I’m taking the space to talk about it in this season of the Money podcast, because I think money is so much more than just our private practices. There’s all these other ways that we can start to generate income by sharing the gifts and the knowledge that we have in ways that go beyond 1 to 1 practice. And then I’ve seen it happen for folks. When you do commit to really teaching what you love and finding those folks who need to hear it and making that connection, not only do you get to transform them, but you also get to be transformed. And your business gets to be transformed by having this whole new way of serving folks that goes beyond just those 1 to 1 treatments or 1 to 1 sessions. It’s really powerful. So, so appreciate my conversation with Nyssa today. If you want to hear more from me, you can check me out on Instagram at @moneynutsandbolts. We are sharing free practical and emotional content on there all the time. And of course, if you’re enjoying the podcast, please take a minute to jump over to Apple Podcasts and leave a review. It is the best way for other therapists to find me. Thanks so much for listening.